263: Amazon's Return to Office Policy and What It Means for You

Amazon CEO Andy Jassy released a statement last week notifying all Amazon employees that they will need to be in the office five days per week beginning in January 2025. How many companies will follow Amazon's lead and require their employees to be in the office five days per week? What does this mean for you?

You can read Andy Jassy's statement here.

In this episode, I'll unpack the benefits of increased in-office collaboration while addressing this policy's challenges to work-life balance and overall employee satisfaction. If you're accustomed to a hybrid work environment, this episode is crucial for you. You’ll also gain valuable strategies to navigate job interviews and career moves in light of such sweeping policy changes.

You must know how you work best and your best working situation. Yes, companies are still hiring fully remote employees, but Amazon's move will change things, and you should be prepared. 

Chapters

• 0:00 Navigating Amazon's Return to Office
• 15:14 Building Your Mid-Career GPS

Transcript

John Neral: 0:00

Last week, amazon CEO Andy Jassy sent an email to all of Amazon's employees and it read, quote hey, team, I wanted to send a note on a couple changes we're making to further strengthen our culture and teams. I'll link up to the entire message in the show notes or you can simply search for it, but the message goes on. To make this point In January of 2025, all of Amazon's corporate employees are expected to return to the office five days a week. Now, without question, this brings up a lot of thoughts up a lot of thoughts both not only for those who work at Amazon, but also for what it means for you and your organization If you've enjoyed working in this hybrid environment and are now being told that it's come back to the office. Or else, what's your best move? In this episode, I'm going to walk you through a few more components of Andy Jassy's message what it means for you as you build your mid-career GPS, and what it might look like for you to handle your next job interview. Let's get started. Hello, my friends, this is the Mid-Career GPS Podcast and I'm your host, John Neral. I help mid-career professionals like you find a job they love, or love the job they have, using my proven four-step formula.

John Neral: 1:42

Last week in my email newsletter I got some very interesting reactions from some people within my email community about this announcement from Amazon regarding their expected return to the office. Now we get a lot of engagement off of my newsletter and I'm really really happy about that. So there's a couple of ways if you want to, and I'm really really happy about that. So there's a couple of ways if you want to come on in to join. So one is you can go to my website, https://johnneral. com. Right there on the homepage there's an option to join my free newsletter community. But also I recently released and exclusively announced to my email newsletter first, a brand new guide called how to Answer Five of the Toughest Interview Questions. It's a free guide. In this guide, I walk you through the question, a proven strategy to answer it, as well as a bonus tip. So if you're preparing for an upcoming job interview, I want you to have this guide. You can get the free guide by going to my website, https://johnneral. com/freebies, download the guide. You'll get the guide. You'll also be into my email community and I look forward to helping you with your next job interview.

John Neral: 2:58

In my newsletter last week, I shared a direct quote from Andy Jassy's message and I want to read that to you here. He wrote quote To address the second issue of being better set up to invent, collaborate and be connected enough to each other and our culture to deliver the absolute best for customers and the business. We've decided that we're going to return to being in the office the way we were before the onset of COVID. When we look back over the last five years, we continue to believe that the advantages of being together in the office are significant". Let me read that last sentence back to you when we look back over the last five years, we continue to believe that the advantages of being together in the office are significant.

John Neral: 3:57

Hearing a message like that, you can have a tremendous amount of thoughts about what returning to the office means. For example, how do you handle those family emergencies? How do you handle flexibility when you've got a doctor's appointment or you're caring for your aging parents? And the entire message goes on to talk about where flexibility and grace is given. And I think that's important to realize that while the expectation is that we're going to be back in the office five days a week, it doesn't mean that there aren't circumstances or situations where grace and understanding and flexibility are given. There's another part of this statement that goes on to say if you're trying to write some difficult code, you might need some independent time and in those specific situations, working from home may be allowed. But again, I want to call out here that this is an exception, it's not the rule. It's not the rule. So, if you and your company are dealing with this idea of what returning to the office is going to look like, what I can share with you in general terms is that practically all of my clients are dealing with this in some way, in some way, and what we have seen over the last five years is that we've gotten pretty good at this remote thing and for a lot of people, they like it.

John Neral: 5:41

But there are advantages to being in the office and I believe it's important that we don't overlook the visibility and the collaboration that happens when we're all in the room together and not behind a screen where we can be easily distracted. Look, we have all been on that Zoom meeting where we have multitasked on some level. We've answered emails, we have played a game, we have scrolled through social media and we've been able to get away with it and I'm not saying that's right or wrong. What I am saying, though, is that when we're in the same room together, those things are less likely to happen, especially if you have a leader who has set up ground rules or norms about how the team is supposed to behave in such a meeting, is supposed to behave in such a meeting. The other thing is, when we're visible in front of our leadership, the interaction and relationship is much different. So do I think it's a bad thing quote unquote that they're going to be back in the office five days a week? I don't, but here's the other piece to this, and, as you followed this story in the news and you followed this news previously, essentially there's an ultimatum If you don't want to adhere to the policy, you can find a job elsewhere, and Amazon's not the only company that's doing this. There are other companies out there that are drawing a very hard line in the sand and saying we want you to return to the office four days, five days a week. If that doesn't match your lifestyle, if that's not the working arrangement you want, we strongly suggest you go find a job elsewhere.

John Neral: 7:50

I am having people reach out to me and clients I'm working with who are saying how do I handle this question that might come up in a job interview. That is something like how do you work best? What are your thoughts about being in the office? How do you work best? What are your thoughts about being in the office? You have to take a look at your situation and circumstance and decide what is the best way for you to answer that question. If it were me, and knowing my situation, the kind of answer I would craft here would be rooted in the advantages I see of me being in the office, as well as the advantages of me working from home when I need to. Also, I'd walk through the disadvantages both from the company side and the employee side. Both from the company side and the employee side, you can craft an answer that is very well thought of in terms of here's where I see the advantages and here's where I don't. And eventually, what will happen and I believe this will happen across every organization that continues to struggle with how much they bring their staff back into the office is this it will all even out. You will figure out where the flexibility is, where the leniency is, where you're able to work from home and you're not.

John Neral: 9:34

Hey, if you have a cold, do they really want you in the office? If you're sick, do they really want you in the office? I truly believe that a sane manager is going to say no, you need to stay home and take care of yourself. As a former school teacher and educator, and for those of you who need to be at the work site anyway, we know there are times when that's really difficult, and I remember sitting with my contract negotiations team and going toe-to-toe with the board of education, the board attorney, when we were negotiating contracts and saying teachers are human beings and they need to be able to take care of themselves and them. Being in front of a room full of kids when they're sick is not to their best advantage, nor to the health and safety of the kids. But if you're a teacher or you have someone in your family you know is a teacher, no-transcript. In the end, all of this evens out and you've heard me say this before on the podcast which is ask for what you need and be careful about asking for what you want. Right, if you need flexibility because your parents are in their 70s or 80s and you're their primary care person and you need to be able to take them to the doctor here and there. That's something you need. Hopefully a manager will understand that and be like, okay, look, we'll give you flexibility here but and then they'll outline their requests as well. So, crafting an interview, a job interview, answer around how you work best or what your thoughts are about being in the office full time those are things I will offer you. You have to ask for. What you need here I have always been somebody, especially when I got out of being a classroom teacher was that there are times when I need think time, I need to be in a quiet space free of distraction, and I need to be able to get a lot of stuff done.

John Neral: 11:53

That was difficult for me sometimes in the office, when people would knock on my door, the phone would ring, the instant message would go off and I felt like I could never get any traction and get stuff done. And, pre-covid, I would go to my supervisor and I would say I need a day to think and crunch these things out. Here's what I'm going to deliver. I'll report back May. I work from home Eight, nine times out of 10, I got a yes on that, so there will be flexibility, but I do believe come 2025, we are going to see more and more companies issue statements very similar to what Amazon did and lean on the fact that there is greater power and more productivity when people are in the room together and not behind the screen.

John Neral: 12:55

If you are a job seeker and you want 100% remote position, they're still out there. You will be able to find them. It might be a little difficult. You will also need to figure out your non-negotiables in terms of how often you would be willing to come into the office. Is it only for an all-hands meeting, or is it for once every two weeks when there's a staff meeting? You have to figure out what the non-negotiables are. So I want to leave you with this.

John Neral: 13:29

When things like this come out, the question becomes who has control? What do you have control over? In a situation like this, the company, on some level, has a tremendous amount of control. They make the policy, they pay you. This is the working agreement. Therefore, do as I say. You are 100% responsible for your career.

John Neral: 13:57

If that no longer is a great fit for you, you can go and find something else fit for you. You can go and find something else If that working arrangement is too stressful for you or it's causing you anxiety or worry about I don't want to be in the office all the time. Find a better fit. But I will offer you here in closing, both parties have control. Offer you here in closing, both parties have control. What works very well is when both parties come to an agreement about what the best fit and working relationship is for them. I wish you the best with this. This will not be the last time we have this conversation. We will watch this and see this kind of unfold.

John Neral: 14:45

But again, if you are actively job seeking excuse me, if you are actively job seeking or thinking you may be looking for a job in the upcoming weeks or in the new year, I want you to get my free guide. Again. It is called how to Answer Five of the Toughest Interview Questions. You can find it right on my website at johnnarrellcom. Forward, slash, freebies or go to the menu bar. It's located under the freebies tab where I keep all of my free resources. Stay tuned.

John Neral: 15:14

There's more stuff coming with that, but in the meantime, my friends, I'll leave you with this. You will build your mid-career GPS, one mile or one step at a time, and how you show up matters. Make it a great rest of your day. Thank you for listening to the Mid-Career GPS Podcast. Make sure to follow on your favorite listening platform and, if you have a moment, I'd love to hear your comments on Apple Podcasts. Visit johnnarrerellcom for more information about how I can help you build your mid-career GPS or how I can help you and your organization with your next workshop or public speaking event. Don't forget to connect with me on LinkedIn and follow me on social at John Nerrell Coaching. I look forward to being back with you next week. Until then, take care and remember how we show up matters. Thank you.