240: Conquer the Networking Game with Sue Maitland

Have you ever felt like networking wasn't for you? Sue Maitland thought the same until she turned her entire career around and learned how to build a networking strategy that was right for her. Join us for a transformative conversation as Sue shares her riveting tale of conquering networking resistance and how she champions others in building a professional community that uplifts, engages, and supports each other. This isn't your average discussion about exchanging business cards; it's an inspiring look at how to network with sincerity and ignite your passion for professional growth.

Balancing life's responsibilities while aiming for career success is a juggling act that many of us know all too well. My own journey through this maze has led to eye-opening realizations about the generous spirit of networking and its capacity to open doors to unexpected opportunities. This episode is brimming with practical takeaways, from preparing for networking events with a mindset of what you can contribute to the nuanced art of small talk that establishes genuine rapport. If you're ready to turn every handshake into a meaningful connection, then this conversation with Sue Maitland is an essential listen.

Connect with Sue Maitland - sue@suemaitland.com
LinkedIn | Website 

Transcript

John Neral: 0:00

Over the last few weeks, I've been sharing some of my networking successes and failures in my twice-weekly email newsletter. These examples have opened up conversations about how everyone can network more genuinely and authentically. Networking is about building relationships that are grounded in trust, respect and support, and let's acknowledge that networking is never a 50-50 type relationship, but it's also not an all-or-nothing relationship either. So if you're struggling to build a networking plan to grow and advance your career, you are going to enjoy today's conversation. In this episode, I am joined by Sue Maitland. Sue's overall message is that anyone can enjoy networking and we're going to show you how let's get started. Hello, my friends, this is the Mid-Career GPS Podcast and I'm your host, John Neral. I help mid-career professionals find a job they love, or love the job they have, using my proven four-step formula. At the top of the episode, I mentioned how I've been talking about networking in my twice-weekly email newsletter community. This is the place where I share career and leadership information, and it's the first place where I announce special events and member-only events. Now I'm going to be hosting a free networking workshop later this month and if you want to be a part of it, I want you to get on my email list. So to do so, visit my website, https:/johnneral. com. You can also check the featured section of my LinkedIn or the show notes, but when you visit my website at https://johnneral. com, and click the link right there on the homepage, you're going to click on the link to join my email community. I'd be honored to have you be a part of it and come join the conversation with all of us.

John Neral: 2:12

Now today's guest is Sue Maitland, and Sue had a decades-long career in the world of IT consulting. That included roles of programmer, project manager, recruiter, resource manager and sales executives, and although she was considered successful, she never really felt inspired by her work in IT. In 2013, sue followed her passion and trained to become a professional life coach, and has never looked back. Sue's services include talks, online courses, virtual networking events, mastermind events and one-on-one coaching, but it's Sue's passion for networking that brings her to us today, because, after overcoming her own resistance to networking and learning to love it, Sue is now a passionate advocate to help everyone cultivate a strong and supportive network. Trust me, you're going to want to take some notes during this episode, and it is my pleasure to introduce you to Sue Maitland. Hey there, sue. Welcome to the podcast. It's great to have you with us today.

Sue Maitland: 3:13

Thank you, John, so much. I really appreciate the invite.

John Neral: 3:16

Well, you and I got a chance to talk a few months ago and I absolutely wanted to have you on the podcast. We're going to talk about all things networking today, but before we get started, Sue, what was your mid-career moment?

Sue Maitland: 3:32

Interesting. So I think my mid-career moment it started before I actually made that decision to make the leap and that was sort of this gradual awareness that I was not happy and satisfied with what I was doing and then starting to think on some way down the road, perhaps I'd like to be a coach. And that was that was a in the back of my mind. The actual moment when I decided to take the leap and leave corporate and sort of take that leap into becoming training to become a coach was when the organization I worked for wanted me to become a regional sales executive, which meant traveling, and at exactly the same time my darling father had been diagnosed with a terminal disease and he lived here in the town that I, the city I live in, and I just wanted to be here for him and mom. The last thing I wanted was be away traveling all the time.

Sue Maitland: 4:33

So this thing that had been bubbling in the back of my mind for the longest time suddenly came to the forefront and I decided you know, I'm going to do it now. This is the right time. I talked to my husband. He was a bit surprised, but he was supportive and I've never regretted it. I absolutely love what I do. I've been a coach now for over a decade and it's the most rewarding work. I'm sure you understand you're in the same business, so to speak but it's that difference we can make in people's lives that's just so rewarding.

John Neral: 5:05

It is Sue, and one of the things that you highlight here and it's often one of the things that I share with people either who ask me why I work with mid-career professionals, or even when I'm talking to potential guests for the podcast is I remind them that, as much as this is a mid-career focused podcast and it often highlights a lot of mid-level leaders and professionals, one of the things we have to remember about this mid-career journey is that there's a part of it where so many people are raising their families and, at the same time, taking care of their aging parents, and when parents get sick and we decide and we make that loving choice to step in and take care of them, our work definitely takes on a different lens because we're balancing so many things, and so I appreciate you sharing that part of your story, particularly because I know that's something so many of my listeners are facing or have faced in terms of taking care of their parents.

Sue Maitland: 6:15

Yeah, absolutely. I'm so glad that I did that, made that choice and that I had that time with them. Both my parents have now passed, but, um, yeah, that and and it helped me. Obviously that career change of becoming an entrepreneur helped me when mom. Mom lived for another 10 years after dad and I was there for both of them.

John Neral: 6:34

So I appreciate them yeah, I, I can, I can relate. My mom lived um almost eight years after my dad had passed and that was such a special time in our relationship as well. But I also I often say it's one of the most loving things we get an opportunity to do. So, yeah, I know right. All right, changing the topic.

Sue Maitland: 7:00

Oh, let's go back on. That's why people like these conversations though right all right, sue you.

John Neral: 7:09

um, you're on today because we're going to talk about networking and you know that networking, when we think about relationship building and what that means there's there's an element of it where we give more than we get, especially initially, and when we were talking during the pre-show and leading up to this interview today, you had shared with me that there was a time when you felt like networking was unfair.

Sue Maitland: 7:45

Yes, yes, that was a crazy.

John Neral: 7:47

Yeah, tell us a little bit about what that thought means for you about networking is unfair.

Sue Maitland: 7:53

I think it was just to do with some things that had happened in my past. I had a bit of a story that perhaps people who got jobs or opportunities or just things doors open for them because of who they knew was somehow cheating. It's really crazy. Fairness is one of my top values, so I realized now that that was potentially what was driving me, and I had some personal experiences around that as well where I yeah, that impacted that. But but when I became a coach, I became an entrepreneur and suddenly this story about, you know, networking being a bad thing.

Sue Maitland: 8:38

I had to revisit that whole thing because how are you? I had this crazy notion that coaching makes such a difference in people's lives that they're just going to line up at the door to work with. It doesn't quite work that way. You got to go out there and meet people and connect with them and find the people who actually need, need your help, and so that meant I had to network, and I had never enjoyed networking. I had actually had a real aversion to it. I'd had some quite unpleasant experiences with it, partly because I didn't understand it. I didn't really know what it was all about and I would go to these events looking terrified.

Sue Maitland: 9:18

And nobody really wanted to talk to somebody who looks terrified right.

John Neral: 9:22

So, yeah, I really had to work to somebody who looks terrified Right, um so um, yeah I, I really had to work to overcome this story, because I did have some bad experiences where I nobody seemed to want to talk to me and uh, when, when you think about that time in your, in your life and career where you felt like networking was unfair and you had these blocks or limiting beliefs around it, what was the one thing that happened for you that shifted your thoughts or your mindset that networking was something you could actually enjoy doing?

Sue Maitland: 10:02

Well, the big thing that changed for me is realizing that if I could get out there and network and make connections and learn about what other people are doing, I could actually help other people by directing them to people and resources that could be helpful to them. And so that was the breakthrough. I joined a business to business networking group, which forced me to introduce myself, and every couple of weeks, and it was really scary at first, and then I got more and more comfortable with it. Then I got to know the people in the group and I started to think, wow, these people could really help other people I know. So I think for me, other people I know.

Sue Maitland: 10:42

So I think for me, one of the greatest joys in networking is being able to connect others with people and resources that could be helpful. But if you are not networking, then you may not know those people and resources to connect people with. So to me it's more about giving than receiving. Sometimes you give to somebody and you don't receive back from them, but they end up talking to someone else and then suddenly somebody oh, I was talking to Kathy, she needs to talk to you. So I think it's going in with that mindset of generosity. That, I think is important.

John Neral: 11:23

I completely agree with you, and you and I are going to take a couple minutes here and we're going to dispel some myths. Okay, so when someone's listening to this and they're thinking they don't believe they're resourceful or they have a great network or who they can connect people to, how do you help someone show up to a networking conversation where they believe that their resources and connections are so limited they don't have anything or have much to give to someone else?

Sue Maitland: 12:03

That's very interesting. Yeah, and I guess what I do is I encourage people to do some research before you go to any kind of networking event. Understand what the format is, understand if you'll have a chance to introduce yourself and if you will, how long do they give you to introduce yourself? Think about what you're going to say. What do you want to communicate to those other people. So doing that initial research takes some of the fear away. Then preparing I know you've got to be yourself, but you want to show up as your best self and you don't want to come away thinking, gee, I wish I'd said this instead of just blurting something out. So I do believe in preparing how you're going to introduce yourself.

Sue Maitland: 12:51

Think about it. What will you say when somebody says to you so what do you do, john, what do you do? And have a nice succinct answer. I like to have it in three parts. The first part really should be something intriguing that makes people want to learn more, and that may be all that. You, that, that's as far as the conversation goes, but if it's intriguing enough, you might find that that person says, oh, tell me more about that, how do you do that? And then the last part should be the difference that you make in people's lives or by either working for them or the contribution you're making. So it's like a three-part intro and you only get to part two if that person shows an interest. That's. I believe in that, and you've got to practice as well. So there's three parts. There's research, repair, and then get out there and actually practice.

Sue Maitland: 13:41

The more you do it, the more you get.

John Neral: 13:44

I don't think you. No, you're good. I don't think you know this about me, but I'm a huge game show fanatic and I grew up in front of the television set watching game shows in the 70s 80s and I still watch a whole bunch today. But when you talk about introducing yourself, if you go back and you watch the game shows of the 70s and 80s, the contestants were prepped with a very specific intro and they would say something like I'm so-and-so, I do this, I live here and I have three kids, two dogs and one cat.

John Neral: 14:21

Now they don't have to do that. They're typically fed some kind of question. So if we take two of the most popular game shows we take Wheel of Fortune and Jeopardy right On Jeopardy the contestants are thrown a question to answer and they're prepped on that answer ahead of time kind of tease up their introduction with a little bit of a fact and they'll get maybe 10 or 15 seconds to talk about themselves. I offer that in this conversation because when you're helping someone prep for an introduction at a B2B or a networking type event and they only have 10, 15, 30 seconds to do that, how do you help people get the most bang for their buck in an introduction that gets people interested or intrigued in them. How do you help them do that?

Sue Maitland: 15:22

Well, I guess I help them look at what they do in a way that allows other people to say oh wow, that's so interesting that you do that. I actually could do with some help like that. Or I know someone else who does what you do. They might like to talk to you about what you're doing and learn from you. So it gives people that opportunity to either understand whether there's something they can do with you or that they can introduce you to someone else who might also benefit from meeting you. So that's what you want to frame it in some way so that they can go oh hey, I know someone you should meet, let me come and introduce you to them. So that's, I think, the ideal scenario.

John Neral: 16:08

What do you suggest when you can't think of somebody who to connect to right away. What's the right answer in that case, when you're like I don't really know anybody and I'm not sure what to say here?

Sue Maitland: 16:25

How do you coach them on that? That's a very interesting one. I haven't really thought about that, because the best, the biggest part of networking is being a good listener. So what I believe is you should have in your back pocket a whole bunch of open-ended questions so that you can get that other person to talk to you, and I think if you can go prepared with that, you'll never be stuck for something to say, and most people like talking about themselves.

Sue Maitland: 16:53

So, and this. I just want to make this point because I'm just about to put an article out there about the five things that stop people from networking, and one of the most important ones that stop people is not being an extrovert. So people who are introverts or shy believe that it's really easy for extroverts to network and it's not really meant for them. They shouldn't be networking. And I want to just dispel that myth because in fact, introverts and shy people are some of the most successful networkers because they're very good at active listening. An extrovert has a tendency to want to talk and share, and they're not always as attuned to listening and then asking follow-up questions to get that person to tell you more, whereas a shy or introverted person can do that. So I want you to know that it's for everybody and anyone can be successful at networking with a little bit of research preparation and practice.

John Neral: 18:00

I like how you call out that introverts can be tremendous networkers because of their ability to listen and build that connection. I see that a lot, too, where people I work with who may be a little shy or a little hesitant and they think about going into these type of networking events, having to be this much bigger person than what they already are, and it freaks them out automatically and go no, no, no, it's okay, let's leverage what you have and make that to your benefit. Sue, in your world, in your areas, is how often right now, where we are in spring of 2024, are you seeing larger networking events or weekly or monthly type gatherings where either professionals, entrepreneurs, small business owners are regularly gathering to come together and network?

Sue Maitland: 19:06

There's no question it's happening. The in-person networking is coming back, but I'm also seeing and it's wonderful, there's nothing quite like having a face-to-face meeting with someone but I'm also seeing that virtual networking is also still very prevalent and the benefit of that is it can connect people outside of your local geography and and so, um, I'm quite active in a number of virtual networking groups. I actually host a virtual networking group for a women in stem. I was in the tech world before I um moved there, so, um, and that's a quarterly thing and it's very well attended. So, um, yeah, it's, it's definitely happening. It's a great opportunity.

Sue Maitland: 19:49

I mean, I don't want to just focus on the in in person either, though I do think linkedin for professionals is a wonderful platform to network and to especially and I'm sure you're to research, to research what it's like to work in a different field. When I'm working with someone who's thinking of making a change, the first thing they do is they get to know themselves better and understand their values and the things they like to do, but then we start to explore possibilities, and I believe that the best way to do that is to talk to someone who's doing what you think you might want to do. The best way to do that is to talk to someone who's doing what you think you might want to do, because what I've seen is so many people who are often trained to do something get into the job and go. Oh, it's not what I thought. I don't love it.

Sue Maitland: 20:35

I got to do something different, so why not talk to people who are doing it and use that as it and LinkedIn is a wonderful platform to do that?

John Neral: 20:45

So, whether someone is going to meet a networking connection for coffee in person or virtually, it's understandable that sometimes people may be worried about how they're going to fill that time fill that time with 15, 25, 30 minutes or whatever. And you talked earlier about having some questions in your back pocket that you could ask people. Can you give us an example of some of those questions that somebody who is a little fearful of networking or nervous about going into this in-person or virtual coffee chat might use? Some of those questions to help them have that conversation a little more effectively?

Sue Maitland: 21:35

Sure, like a simple one would be. I'd love to understand more about how you got into this business that you're in or the role that you're in. Another one which I really encourage everybody to do, because it's so important, is tell me about the culture of the company that you work for. Can you describe it for me and perhaps give me some examples of how that plays out? Because there's often a wonderful sounding website with the corporate culture, but it may not actually be true. So you know, it's a great way to actually learn more.

Sue Maitland: 22:12

So, just being curious, like you keep that curious mindset and you'll find, and somebody answers and you say can you tell me a bit more about that? So you don't have to have everything scripted, but you do want to be prepared. You also need to be prepared with what you want to communicate, because if you're having this networking experience with someone who knows, they may end up being an ongoing connection for you that could open doors for you down the road. So by doing this research that you're doing, by meeting people in different career paths, you're also building, expanding your network with lots of possibilities down the road.

John Neral: 22:54

How much small talk should you do?

Sue Maitland: 22:56

Well, I think you want to just a little bit at the beginning, just to warm things up a little bit. You don't want to go straight in with a question, you know. Tell me what the culture is like where you work, you know, just talk a little bit about the weather, what you've been up to, have you had a good weekend, whatever. But then yeah, it's okay. I think the thing is go into it being yourself with a little bit of a plan, but be flexible too. You know see where the conversation goes. You don't have to drive it. You can just plant a few little questions and you're going to find people who open up and share all kinds of information.

John Neral: 23:34

Oh, sue, that's so good. Yeah, absolutely right. You don't have to drive the conversation right, you have those questions and let them go there. And I want to offer for anybody listening the reason I asked Sue that small talk question is you do want to kind of ease away into the conversation, so have something that's a safe topic to discuss. It could be something like Sue mentioned about the weather. If you're big into sports, it could be something with that. If there's something happening current event-wise that isn't a hot-buttoned topic, you want to obviously avoid those type things. So, um, sue, I'll tell you this just just as an aside here I had scheduled a virtual coffee with a networking connection, a new person who had reached out.

John Neral: 24:27

I wasn't really sure whether we were going to be great connections for other people or not, but you go into the call with an open mind and you have it, and this was back in late 2020, early 2021. So we're like within a year of the lockdown and the pandemic. And so we get to the call and I asked a very general question and I said how are you a tribe about their beliefs about lockdown and masks and COVID and how they had very, very strong opinions about it. And then he did the wrong thing, which was he said what do you think? And so now you've invited me into this hot button issue, to which I shared that in my circle of close friends we actually lost somebody very, very early on in the pandemic due to COVID. And I said something like well, you're entitled to your opinion, but in my world this is what happened and this isn't really a great way for us to start this conversation. So how can I be a helpful networking connection for you? And there was this dead silence on the call, like realizing that this probably wasn't the best way to start off.

John Neral: 26:07

And when we got done with the call, he said to me when would you like to meet again? And I said I wouldn't. And he went, excuse me. And I said look, this is about respecting our time.

John Neral: 26:24

I said the reason why I don't believe we're great networking connections for each other is because your circle and my circle aren't closely aligned. You're not going to feed clients my way and I'm not going to feed clients your way. So from a business relationship, I don't see a synergy and I don't want to just come together for the sake of having another conversation. I said that's the reason why I don't want to meet. And he went what about the other thing? And I said, well, we have a difference of opinion on that, but no, that's not the reason, right? And so when you, when you mention about being yourself I think that's such an important part to bring into the conversation as well is be true to who you are, but always see if there is a way to find ways to connect with people, cause, like you said, you never know where you're going to, where it's going to land or where you're going to meet somebody.

Sue Maitland: 27:23

Be yourself, but be your best self.

John Neral: 27:25

Yeah.

Sue Maitland: 27:26

Not a place for venting Right.

John Neral: 27:34

Exactly so, sue. We're going to start wrapping up here in a moment, but I just want to take a couple extra minutes here. Do you have a particular networking success story, either from yourself or from one of your clients or people whom you're connected with, that you could share with us really quickly about why networking is so powerful?

Sue Maitland: 27:55

Actually it's a personal networking experience and it's virtual networking. Actually, I belong to an organization it's called Women's Speakers Association and we have virtual networking calls once a month and we had somebody visit from Australia. We joined our call from Sydney, australia. I really enjoyed her energy and I suggested that we have a virtual networking call afterwards and she said she agreed. So we had our coffee virtual coffee. She ended up test driving one of my online courses. She loved it so much. She said I have a friend that I want to introduce you to. She's in adelaide.

Sue Maitland: 28:36

So here I am in victoria bc, canada, and I got connected with adelaide. I am now um, part of um, a foundation. So my my course is being recommended by a foundation for people who are in abusive relationships because it creates a space for people to really ask themselves what's important to me at this point in my life. And I mean I actually yeah, I just feel I had no idea that it was going to lead to that. I just went into my conversation with my first contact in Sydney with an open mind, chat, sharing about it, and it just feels so good to have had so that to me. But I've got many other stories where my clients have, you know, made great connections, found work through making those connections, but that, for me, is probably the most.

John Neral: 29:28

But, what a powerful way, though, for you to make a connection where they're willing to help you expand your work in ways you hadn't imagined or envisioned. Yeah, yeah. It's incredible.

Sue Maitland: 29:42

Yeah, so so that was it's. It's it's about going into the conversation with an open mind and not, you know, not being close to things. That who knows?

John Neral: 29:53

Right.

Sue Maitland: 29:53

Being curious what could happen yeah absolutely Well, Sue.

John Neral: 29:58

I have truly enjoyed our conversation here today, so I'd be remissed if I didn't ask you this what advice would you give someone to help them build their mid-career GPS to whatever is next for them in their career?

Sue Maitland: 30:15

Well, I think you've got to do the work, to think about what you're get to know yourself, get to know what you're interested in, and then I do believe getting out there and doing that research is so important. So research the kind of companies that you might want to work for and go and reach out and connect with people there. Arrange to have these kind of conversations where you can actually ask them about what their job entails, what the company's like to work for, what are trends that are happening in the industry? What qualifications do you need to actually be successful in that career? I haven't mentioned this, but I mean I ended up. Never thought I would do this.

Sue Maitland: 30:57

I ended up developing a networking course. It's called Networking for Success and it's actually on my website and it does take people through that whole process I went through. It was quite a journey, from hating networking to not only loving it but now being invited to speak at conferences and lead networking events. But I figured I wanted to help other people do that too. So that is actually available on my website. And then the other thing that we're adding to it is a community. So once you've completed the workshop, you actually get to practice your networking in a safe virtual environment with other people who are also learning to network, and we have some mastermind classes as well. So I'm really excited about that, nice.

John Neral: 31:40

Yeah, good. Well, sue, look, if people want to learn more about you, connect with you further, connect to your digital courses, and I know there's something upcoming you want to share with everybody as well. I'm going to turn the mic over to you and please tell us all the great things where people can connect and find you.

Sue Maitland: 31:58

Well, I love connecting on LinkedIn, so you should be able to find me. If you go in and type Sue Maitland, I'm pretty sure you'll find me there. I'd love to connect. My website is it's Sue S-U-E Maitland no dot Sue M-A-I-T-L-A-N-D dot com. And if you go into that website, you can sign up for my newsletter where I share actually tips from the world of positive psychology for living a more fulfilled life. But you'll also find information on my online courses and blog posts a lot of blog posts on networking and other things as well. So, yeah, I think that's the best way to connect with me, through the website or through LinkedIn. I always love expanding my network.

John Neral: 32:49

Ray, I will make sure all of that is in the show notes for people to go back and find, and we'll certainly be posting about this on LinkedIn. But, sue Maitland, thank you so much for being a wonderful guest on the Mid-Career GPS podcast.

Sue Maitland: 33:02

It was wonderful, my pleasure. Thank you so much for inviting me, john. I look forward to staying in touch.

John Neral: 33:07

Absolutely, we're going to continue our networking thing as well. But, my friends, look, your takeaway from today's episode is this Do your research. There's one thing Sue really drove home about networking is that you can't go into any kind of a networking conversation without doing your research and preparing for what's going to happen. Know the kind of event you're going to, whether it be one-on-one or a larger in-person or virtual networking event. Know the people who are going to be there and, more importantly, have a series of questions that you have either committed to memory or can easily access on your smartphone to look at and reference to keep that conversation going. And I will tell you my favorite tip from Sue was, especially if you're an introvert, you do not have to drive the conversation when you're networking. Be a phenomenal listener, be engaged, ask wonderful questions and always remember to give more than you get when you're networking. So until next time, my friends, remember this you will build your mid-career GPS one mile or one step at a time, and how you show up matters. Make it a great rest of your day.

John Neral: 34:31

Thank you for listening to the Mid-Career GPS Podcast. Make sure to follow on your favorite listening platform and if you have a moment, I'd love to hear your comments on Apple Podcasts. Visit johnnarrellcom for more information about how I can help you build your mid-career GPS, or how I can help you and your organization-career GPS, or how I can help you and your organization with your next workshop or public speaking event. Don't forget to connect with me on LinkedIn and follow me on social at John Darrell Coaching. I look forward to being back with you next week. Until then, take care and remember how we show up matters. Thank, you.